Nice 25DC mk2

[John Wakefield]

Found this pic on the internet some guy by the name of Chic of Mar Vista, Los Angles, California, USA.
A very nice example of a 25DC Mk2 (4T engine) Sports Twin the blue version of the East Coaster. Not sure that its not an East Coaster as it has long UK number plate & high bars & owner says its 1965
Looks like he has other Greeves as well http://jalbum.net/en/browse/user/album/134731/

[Brian Catt]

Looks like a Brit tax disc on his TES.

[John Wakefield]

Yep, so maybe the 25DC was an import from the UK as well. I dont think Greeves would have fitted the long rear number plate for export models. It only came in in 1965 on the East Coaster to accomodate the longer UK registration numbers. Hopefull one of our US members will know the guy & put him in touch if he is not already a member.

[Les Pilgrim]

2T centre crankshaft seals

Out of,(Morbid!), interest,what have members impressions been, of symptoms of a failing centre bearing seal, on the 2T,(and 4T) engines?
I had the crankshaft on my old 25DC overhauled, way back in the 60's,(By Alpha Bearings), and the symptoms I experienced were severe pinking,(detonation), on both cylinders,due presumably, to the lean run effect resulting from the leaky seal.It had 10.1 comp heads,and I'd tried everything, from 5star gas,40:1 oil ratios,(using Bardahl)retarding ignition, etc, all to no avail.Having the crankshaft overhauled rectified the matter!!.

My present 2T,is showing odd signs,I think/hope!, of excessively rich mixture, ,(maybe the jet on the S22 carb has had a drill through it, at some point!), as after about 10 mins running, the RH cyl misfires,(backfires), and the plugs look well rich,with the RH one not sparking, until its been cleaned thoroughly.

I'm going to fit a new main jet, and re check the carb float height settings etc, but would be interested in comments on any other experiences members may have had, of this type.

It's using new coils,leads,plugs, points, and I'm told the condensers are OK,(tested for capcity etc), tho' I will be fitting new ones shortly.

All part of Lifes rich Tapestry!!

Les

[John Wakefield]

Found this pic on the internet some guy by the name of Chic of Mar Vista, Los Angles, California, USA.
A very nice example of a 25DC Mk2 (4T engine) Sports Twin the blue version of the East Coaster. Not sure that its not an East Coaster as it has long UK number plate & high bars & owner says its 1965
Looks like he has other Greeves as well http://jalbum.net/en/browse/user/album/134731/

I have now made contact with the owner Charles Sales. The frame number is 25DC 392 (no B) which makes it a non East Coaster in fact Charles does not know of any East Coasters in USA so it poses a question as to whether the East Coaster name & black paintwork were ever used in USA.
Charles tells me he was a GRA member some years ago so maybe some of you may know of him. I have suggested he join the forum.
Some more of his pics appear on:-

http://gallery.me.com/charlessales#gallery

[John Wakefield]

Reply from owner Charles

Hello-Hello:
My Greeves 25DC392. I bought my road twin from Nick Nicholson on July 19, 1992. I do not know of any East Coasters imported to the US.
If I remember correctly, my 25DC has between 3500 and 4000 mile since new!
It is authentic and unrestored. It has everything BUT the exhaust stuffers.
Nick was the BIG US importer. He basically kept the motorcycle side of Bert Greeves alive.
In the small bore class, “everybody” had a Greeves for Desert Racing. Husky came along and things began to change. CZ had NO IMPACT in Desert Racing. They were basically track bikes.
Nick imported road twins (probably fewer than 20). He gave this particular road twin to his older brother, who lived in Iowa. When his older brother became too old to operate the bike, he gave it back to Nick. Nick took the bike to a “Greeves Day”, held in Kettleman City, CA. He also brought along a Montesa Cota (in authentic and unrestored condition) to sell. I bought the Montesa on the spot.
Nick would not quote a price on the 25DC, so nobody made him an offer.
I was VERY INTERESTED in the Greeves, so I got his telephone number.
He lived at Lake Isabella, California. Boy, his place was hard to find. He had to post signs with arrows for anyone to find him. I drove up, and he took me for a trial ride. Lake Isabella is at altitude, so I had some difficulties with my Greeves MCS. Nick had a 200cc Honda trail bike that was properly jetted. HE RODE MY ASS OFF. Nick won the AMA Daytona road race (I believe 1952 or 1953). Nick was the predecessor to Dick Mann. He could ride in ANY type of race and WIN. He was in his late 60’s when I met him and he was still outstanding.
Anyway, I began to pester Nick for a price and after 2 trips up to his little place we agreed, and I took the bike home with me.
Nick raced Greeves at first, to get the bikes seen. Of course, he won many desert races (Hare and Hound). No track, just a large cloverleaf type course with start/finish/staging in the middle of the leaf. 1 complete lap of the total cloverleaf. NOBODY PRE-RODE THE COURSE. Those old hare and hounds were just the best! Not like MX where the course is VERY SHORT and repeated for x laps. The courses were marked by throwing paper bags filled with lime down at turns or danger spots and marking the rest with ribbons for direction and small signs with arrows for turns (preceded by a lime bag extravaganza).
YOU DO NOT WANT TO GET LOST IN THE MOJAVE DESERT, BELIEVE ME. The old desert races WERE NOT JUST A SAND THING. Believe me, there are some mountains and MANY huge boulders in the Mojave, and that is just where the courses went. Remember this, in the old movies and photos of those races, all of the camera people were down in the sand. Hiking up into the mountains was/is a BITCH. Just getting up there on a Greeves was a bitch. To finish one of those races (100-150 miles) was a thrill. Just about impossible for an amateur to win. Triumph, Greeves and all the others had factory support and their bikes were “tricked out” for the time.
I am 69 years old now. I have owned 65 dirt bikes, 34 of them Greeves. My newest bike ever was my 1985 Rokon, but my newest competition dirt bike was my 1971 380 Griffon (went to a collector in Belgium). I do not ride much anymore. I will probably sell all of the Greeves but the 24TFS.
I was a member of the GRA starting in the early/mid 1980’s, but it was expensive to be a member, so I dropped out. I still have the newsletters somewhere.
Nice to hear from you.
Go here and see more.

http://gallery.me.com/charlessales#gallery

Charles Sales

[John Wakefield]

East Coasters - more questions

The pic from Charles Sales again poses the question on what is an East Coaster & what is not.
The model as we know for sure is the 25DCMk2, Mk2 signifying 4T engine as with the 25DDMk2 Essex.
What is uncertain is when the East Coaster (EC) was introduced as a model (history suggests from 1965) & what consitutes an EC from a standard 25DC Mk2.
Various books & indeed our own Identification Listing document the East Coaster as being those built from frame No 25DC 350 onwards, but clearly Charles bike (25DC 392) is well after the change over date.
There is also the matter of the suffix B which again was assumed all frame numbers after 350 recieved, obviously not so, & I know of another UK one
25DC 368 again painted blue.
So if we assume the suffix B relates to those bikes painted Black, does this also make them EC's?
The main difference from a standard 25DC mk2 is that the EC had high rise bars, where as the standard (blue?) 25DC Mk2 had low bars, Charles bike has high rise bars & is identical to the EC spec other than the paintwork.
This is a bit like saying that a 1960's Triumph T120 is a Bonniville with blue and grey paint work, but just a T120 in any other colour.
To sum up it seems strange that few (if any) East Coasters were sold in USA when it was named for that reason. Why was Black paint chosen for the EC a colour not normally used by Greeves?

[John Wakefield]

32DC East Coaster

I have just received following email from Stan Nicholson of Ottawa, Canada. Looks like Greeves made some 32DC EC's for the US market. So looks as though the East Coaster name was already in use in the states before being used here in the UK on the 25DC mk2 in black from 1965-66.

Stan's email:
Hi John,
Re the thread on the GRA site about East Coasters, I have a 32DC, frame number 32DC 148B, engine number 3T222D 952 that I have owned for quite a few years that is awaiting restoration when I give up road racing my Silverstone and Yamaha TD2B.
I do not know what year it was manufactured/first registered in the US but it was imported into Mass. If you send me your email address I can scan a reprint of a road test of the 32DC "East Coaster" that the Eastern US importer used as sales information. The bike I have is the same as the one in the reprint, 3T motor, alloy guards, twin exhausts, switch on the side of the headlight and black and silver in colour.
Stan Nicholson

(Maybe someone can help Stan with the manufacturing date of his bike)

[John Wakefield]

32DC "East Coaster" road test

Here is the road test of the 32DC "East Coaster" sent in by Stan. It is obviously a 'doctored' version of the Motor Cycling UK 32DC test. Presumably done by a US distributor. Strange that the pic is LTW 48C the UK 25DC East Coaster tested by Motor Cycle Mechanics & now owened by John Sillett.
One would have thought the 32DC was out of production by the time the UK 25DC East Coaster appeared in 1965. It looks very much as though the East Coaster name was being used in the states some time prior to the launch of the 25DC mk 2 version here in UK, & on the 32DC & possibly the 25DCMk1 (2T)