New Greeves progress in 2011 SSDT?

[156trials]

Wonder if anyone has heard how the 3 man Greeves team riding the SSDT is getting on?

[Brian Catt]

I bike definitely retired, 1 on 2003 marks, so looks retired, one still running on 307 marks. Try www.ssdtresults.co.uk

[156trials]

Seems a shame, but does appear to prove that all the claims about the new bike made by the producer, appear to be complete nonsense! Wonder why they didnt look at producing a modernised version of an original Greeves bike, along the lines of the new DOT trials bikes, rather than waste a lot of money on trying to build a modern bike?

[John Wakefield]

New Greeves

Greeves Motorcycles have already produced a revampt Anglian & a Anglian based trail bike The Pathfinder (not the original Puch engined Pathfinder) but neither caught on. Too expensive & people want real classics not repros.
Personally I dont see much future for this company other than maybe in the restoration & supply of parts for the original Greeves models.

[156trials]

The old style Greeves bikes produced by Richard Deal, didnt seem likely to be much more competitive than the originals. This means they were not likely to appeal to anyone for competition, with the only possible market being people interested in original type bikes, but who maybe could not find exactly what they were looking for?

New type Dots, with modern steering and suspension geometry, and chrom-moly frames half the weight of the originals, are more the type of bike people are looking for nowadays, and a Greeves along the same lines may well have been a great success.

[Brian Catt]

Phil Hanlon on 170 now at 355 marks lost, leader is under 10 with tomorrow still to come.
Just realised the file I'm watching is incomplete as there is about 8 sections still to be entered.

[dave higgins]

How dissapointing to keep hearing members of this forum putting the new greeves & rd down.
Its all to easy to sit back & poor cold water on his efforts, but how many of
you could engineer a bike like that & get it right first time? no!, i thought not.
Richard deal managed to attend the agm to support the gra & i think a few more people ought to get behind him & help him push the greeves name forward.
Greeves might have had their hay day in the 60`s, but it doesn`t have to end there does it, trying to launch a new brand in a deep recession is never going to be easy & hopefully the new greeves can find a slot in the market where it can gain a foot hold & continue.

[John Wakefield]

Greeves in 2011 SSDT

Dave
No one is putting the Greeves down, but they are just stating the obvious of how things are.
Frankly its a David & Goliath situation. The big boys, Gas Gas, Sherco etc versus the small man, Richard Deal & the Greeves.
In this, the world stage of trials the Greeves was always an outsider, not because it was vastly inferior to the other bikes, but because it is the rider rather than the bike that gets results. I dont suppose there is much to choose performance wise between any of the bikes, they all look the same & have engines of similar performance, weigh the same etc etc, so its the rider who's going to make the difference. If Dougie Lampkin had been on a Greeves maybe it would have been a different story. In fact I suppose its always been that way. Even in the Thundersley days it was the rider who made the difference. If Bert Greeves had fielded a team of clubmen rather than the likes of Don Smith & Bill Wilkinson, would Greeves have won then? I think not.
Riders cost money, bikes cost money, its a big boys sport, sadly the small man with limited resorces is never going to make top dog in this the toughest trial in the world.

[156trials]

Realistically without either a great deal of money, or the type of technical expertise of someone like John Britten for instance, the design and production of a new trials machine, which is superior to other machines currently on the market, is likely to be an extremely difficult undertaking.

Its certainly commendable to get involved with something like this though, and quite unfair for the trials community in general to dismiss the new bike out of hand. Failure in Scotland is a setback obviously, but the first water-cooled Beta ridden by Jordi Tarres also failed, as did the works Beta Evo of Dougie Lampkin in the SSDT and the Scott last year!

[John Wakefield]

Reliablity of modern trials bikes

One wonders if these modern bikes are up to the rigors of these long distance trials such as the SSDT & the Scott Trial. They are after all 'trick'
bikes with no seats, designed for arena/short distance type events that have now become the norm. The reliabillity factor is not important here as a spare bike will be in the van!
Long may events like the Scottish continue.

[156trials]

Modern trials bikes are not particularly suited to riding long distances on the road. However the failures of the Beta works bikes last year, were I think related to simple component failures, rather than anything to do with design shortcomings.

In general though the reliability of all modern trials machines (with the exception of Honda, and Scorpa with Yam motors), is not comparable to that of old air cooled trials bikes, and most modern bikes have problem areas.

[greeves246]

reliability

yes its shame they faile but what failed ? on the bikes
rolls royce approach test till destruction then make stronger the part that failed
this is how the company works

greeves246

[156trials]

I get the feeling that the new Greeves project will now get quietly shelved!

Seems a shame, but the bike never looked as though it was designed to be produced in anything more than single figure numbers.

From the perspective of even small scale production, making major component parts from solid billet, simply isnt feasible commercially!

Unless the price of the finished bike was going to be 50-60% more than current trials machines............which probably might result in very few sales.

[Brian Catt]

It seems that Phil Hanlon finished the Trial, albeit with a telephone number score against the winner's 13 marks lost. To me, the idea of setting up a small volume production factory is indeed ridiculous financial gambling. The strength of the market in the UK is not there, and brand loyalty to the existing makes would prevent a wholesale defection to the new Greeves, even if they were of comparable price. The foreign factories also have MX and Enduro bike in their portfolio, so are not dependent on the sole line to keep going. The bike is "conventional" by modern standards, not like some of the competition. Mind I'd like to know where OSSA found all those sets of girder forks that their bike appears to have on it's frame!
Good luck to RD in his efforts, but once the grant money goes, I can't see it being a feasible project.

[156trials]

Quite right on the finances Brian............it might have been a better idea to concentrate on a modern day version of an original Greeves model, along similar lines to the new DOT?

I didnt know that the new bike was grant funded............not altogether sure this is the ideal way to be spending taxpayers money though!