Greeves Speedo Cables

[John Wakefield]

W Gaggs & Son list a number of cables for Greeves http://www.gaggs.co.uk/html/cable.html They give lengths and part numbers so easy to order correct one for your bike.
They are at:
Unit C21a, The Byron Industrial Estate, .
Arnold
Nottingham, NG5 7ER
0115 9786288
gagg@mail.com

[IanCordes]

Good tip John. Interestingly, they list all Greeves cables with the same part number, despite there being 2 different lengths. Having said that, they list the models, so as long as they know which model it is for, there should be no problem. Be aware that, if you have a late model, around 1964- on, the grey faced 60mm speedo had a different threaded cable connector, which means that the knurled nut on the end of the cable is too short to pick up the threads on the back of the speedo. It requires a longer knurled nut. They are aware of this; quote from their website :-
' In most cases there are only two types of cable fitting at the speedo clock end. Short nut or long nut. Chronometric instruments fitted to 1964 had the short nut fitting whilst magnetic instruments fitted from late 1964 had the long nut fitting. The smaller 60m/m speedo which are of the magnetic type used from the mid 1950s also had a cable change and clock design change in late 1964'.
I bought a cable for my 1964 20DC, along with the spade fitting required to connect to the rear wheel right-angled drive, from VS. The cable had the short nut, so would not fit. Fair enough they said, we will send you the correct one. Also, the spade fitting they sent would not fit inside the speedo outer cable, being too large a diameter! I sent them both back as agreed. That was about 6 weeks ago at least, and I am still waiting for the replacements. Hence, it is good to know other suppliers are available.

[John Wakefield]

Another thing, although Greeves always used the rear wheel drive on the roadster twins (and the singles) It is possible to use the drive from the gearbox as was used by Francis Barnett and the cable length is about a foot shorter. Gaggs are well known Smiths speedo restorers.

[IanCordes]

That is true. The twins have a blanking plate over the gearbox drive take-off, and so do some of the singles gearboxes, but not all. Some casings have not been machined to accept the drive. I have a couple of those gearbox drive units, which can be bought relatively cheaply at jumbles compared with the right-angled rear wheel drive units. They both have different ratios, so another minefield! It may be simply one is for a single and one for a twin, I don't know...... Any ideas, anyone?

[IanCordes]

Ok, in case anyone is interested (!), here is the answer to my own question regarding the gearing of the gearbox-mounted speedo drive gearboxes ; with me so far? I have checked my parts books, where all is revealed. They were fitted to electric start twins, a 29T gear wheel for standard gear ratios, 30T for a wide-ratio box. On the single engines which used them, there was a choice of 26T or 27T for standard ratio gearboxes, 28T & 29T for wide ratio boxes. Presumably there was a choice to allow for rear wheel & tyre diameter? To complicate matters, the worm gear in the speedo drive unit could have either 8T; which I believe was standard; or 7T; whilst the wormwheel would be either 12T (standard) or 13T. The unit for the twins only lists the 8T worm gear and 12T wormwheel. Having unearthed my 2 drive units from the shed, one has a 28Tgear wheel, which would suit a wide-ratio-equipped single engine, the other having a 26T gear wheel, which looks good for a standard roadster single. Is anyone still awake? I'm trying to keep the forum alive here!!

Ian

[John Wakefield]

Certainly the gearbox drives are a much better engineering solution as they are lubricated by the gearbox oil, and also have a shorter cable. The single (9E 32A etc) unit being underneath the gearbox could be subject to damage (particularly on trials bikes), but the twins 2 3 and 4T have the drive out of the top of gearbox, and as most twins came with drive fitted, I wonder why Greeves spent extra money on the hub drive unit. Of course any change in final drive gear ratio (gear box and rear wheel sprocket) will effect the accuracy of the speedo. But with the standard sprockets fitted it should be somewhere near. The rear wheel drive units were well known to give over reading.

[John Wakefield]

I have received this PM from Peter Smith who is having difficulties posting on the new forum and has asked me to post in this thread.

John.
,
I'm struggling to use this new Forum layout and can't find how to post a message about Gaggs Speedo Service, so maybe you could put this on for me.

I bought a Greeves speedo cable from Gaggs a couple of weeks back for my Tri-Greeves. Nothing could have been easier, I looked up the various Greeves cables available on thier website, selected the length I required, rang them and got a very helpful chap on the phone who took my order, asked if I required a spade (which I didn't) and paid by card. The next morning the cable arrived in the post. It fitted perfectly. Great service.

Peter

[Colin Sparrow]

If you're out there, Pete, all you have to do is write your reply in the box at the bottom of the page where it says "Write something", and when you're ready, press "Post reply"

[IanCordes]

Thanks Pete. Trouble is VS have my money, and are not talking to me. I have been told not to contact them to ask when the cable will be ready, I will know when it arrives on my mat. Charming....

[Geoff]

Excellent info. I am not sure my bike ever had a speedometer drive on the rear wheel I now have something to look for to see if I can run one off the gearbox.

[John Wakefield]

If its your TES you are referring to Geoff, then it would have had the drive in rear hub, but a gearbox drive may be an option if the gearbox has a aperture machined to take it. I suspect the it may not. If you are not worried about originality and just need a speedo to be road legal then an electronic digital cycle speedo would be you best and cheapest option, and far more accurate.

[IanCordes]

Geoff. If it is a TES, as John correctly says, it would have had a right-angle drive on the rear wheel. On the right hand side of your rear hub should be a hole with a blanking plug in it, into which goes the drive unit. You need to look inside the hub to see if you have the drive gear in place. It will cost you dear to purchase the whole set. The gearbox drive units are quite cheap by comparison. It would have had a D shaped speedo, once again they are very expensive, as they are chronometric. The 60mm round magnetic speedos of the period are a fraction of the price. As for the electronic digital job, there was one on my roadster when I bought it, and it immediately went in the bin. Electronic digital speedos have their place on modern bikes, but, and no offence to John, not 54-60 year old classics, imo.
Ian

[John Wakefield]

I did say "If you are not worried about originality" OK digital speedos were not fitted back in the day but neither were speed camera's . So the chance of getting a fixed £60 fixed penalty was zilch. More like a friendly warning by PC Plod and sent on your way. The small cycle speedos are easily fitted and removed without having to make modifictions so can be removed without trace.
They also have the added bonus of having a trip meter and clock built in. I have one on my bike, but retained the old inaccurate Smiths unit. So if you want it to look right just fit the speedo head and a dummy cable disappearing under the engine.

[Geoff]

Thanks! I had intended to go with a bicycle speedometer as the gear set it long gone. There is a wooden bung in the hole for the drive now. The more I learn about these Greeves the more I am extremely happy to have one .

[350biker]

Colin East of East Restorations (Navenby, Lincolnshire) rebuilt my rear wheel speedo gearbox and supplied the right length cable with fittings to go from there to the D shaped chronometric correctly mounted on the top yoke. Hope that might help somebody.