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Castrol R40 - suitable for Griffon gearbox and clutch?

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  • Castrol R40 - suitable for Griffon gearbox and clutch?

    Hi,
    In a previous post - I remember Adrian saying that he uses Castrol R exclusively (everywhere) on his hawkstone...........i.e clutch, gearbox and petrol oil mix.......am sure if he had cerianis he would put it in thos as well

    Having just had to rebuild my griffon gearbox - I am wondering whether to do the same.

    Re the griffon clutch which presumably is different to the villers clutch - is there any reason why this would not work?
    - and if so what would be the best fluid to use - (for fast starts of course !)
    Thanks for any advice from Adrian - or others on this.
    Cheers Kim
    Last edited by Kim275; 04/06/2011, 03:31 PM.

  • #2
    Kim ,

    The works bikes ran on Shell Super H in the gearboxes , a vegetable oil almost as thick as Ep90 , was also used in the petrol mix until shell came up with an oil used in two stroke racing boat engines - S7928 , I believe .

    Chaincase always had SAE10 oil . no reason why ATF shouldn't do , it was used in the Pch engines .

    Chris

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    • #3
      Castrol R40

      Kim,

      Current thinking is R40 for the engine, EP80 or 90 for the gearbox and Shell Vitrea 22 for the clutch (Geoff Nunn swears by Vitrea for the clutch). But each to his own.

      Druid

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      • #4
        Hi kim, riflegreen is right about atf, every body has been using it for years, anything thicker seems to make the clutch cling & drag.
        Atf is a very hard working oil, the pressure in power steering & auto g/boxes is extremely high, far higher than a griffon clutch will ever put it through.
        I reckon though that adrian must be on a good kick back from castrol, the way he promotes it, he even does his chips in it!!!!....

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        • #5
          Too right Dave, I'll bet you're really looking forward to that early morning morning Bacon Butty now! And why do you think I have such a wonderful complexion and such a full head of hair. And what about completing the Edinburgh Marathon last year, it's brilliant for joints as well, better than Emu oil I'm sure.
          I've really no knowledge of oils whatsoever, the reason I've stuck with "R" is that the guy who I purchased my MDS from in '86 informed me that the gearbox survived without problem using it, unlike the recommended variant! Similarly, attending a 210 Kart meeting at Snetterton in the mid nineties I met up with the Thacker family, who were running the series then, they used it in the clutch too, so I've followed suit ever since. It seems to have worked out OK for me, but of course my bikes have a very easy time of it, after all they only just have to have a little more power than needed to pull a skin off a rice pudding in order to propel me along at the necessary rate of knots. It's in the Griffon too, but from the debris that emanates from the clutch on draining I think it needs changing regularly, whatever one might choose.

          (Note; posts on 'Mortimer 100 Regs' have been copied and moved here to keep this thread 'on-topic' (i.e. Gearbox and, ahem, Emu oils...!) Click here to view; http://www.greeves-riders.org.uk/for...ead.php?t=2640 Brian.)
          Last edited by Brian Thompson; 18/06/2011, 12:30 AM. Reason: Post edited as new thread started on 'Mortimer 100 Regs' in 'Events, Meetings and Shows' Forum, here; http://www.greeves-riders.org.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=2640

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          • #6
            Transmission oil

            TQF or equivalent is my recommendation. The only downside is keeping the stuff in side the cases. You need to be meticulous about joint faces and use a good RTV type silicon. I know this will offend the purists but it does work.

            The gears in a Villiers/Greeves 'box are relatively lightly loaded so ideal for a thin oil. On the primary drive it is only lubricating the chain.

            Phil

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            • #7
              Hi adrian, emu oil? well!! whatever you get up to in your own garage is up to you?, but don`t over do it....
              As for healthy complection & full head of hair, ( should have gone to spec savers )...
              But i do agree with you adrian, castrol r40 in my books has never been surpassed i think there are better specific oils for one purpose, but never a better all rounder.
              Tqf, phil, i have not heard of that since my apprenticeship on ford commercials 30 yrs ago, never come across it since, i thought it was a motorcraft variant of atf, be interesting to know though, i think the q facter may be a viscosity rating. dave

              Comment


              • #8
                In respect of oil to mix with fuel, for race use the best currently available is something like Castrol XR77 which is fully synthetic, and designed specifically for pre mix applications. This is also ok for trials and road applications, but needs to be run at leaner mix ratios to reduce clogging.

                Old style vegetable oils lubricate pretty well, but tend to leave quite a lot of gum and deposits inside a motor, which is not a problem on race motors which are stripped on a regular basis, but can be an issue on motors which are not stripped often.

                Not that great an idea to use vegetable oils in gearboxes, as they tend to attract water, and this may lead to corrosion on bikes which are used infrequently.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by ADickerson View Post
                  Too right Dave, I'll bet you're really looking forward to that early morning morning Bacon Butty now! And why do you think I have such a wonderful complexion and such a full head of hair. And what about completing the Edinburgh Marathon last year, it's brilliant for joints as well, better than Emu oil I'm sure.
                  I've really no knowledge of oils whatsoever, the reason I've stuck with "R" is that the guy who I purchased my MDS from in '86 informed me that the gearbox survived without problem using it, unlike the recommended variant! Similarly, attending a 210 Kart meeting at Snetterton in the mid nineties I met up with the Thacker family, who were running the series then, they used it in the clutch too, so I've followed suit ever since. It seems to have worked out OK for me, but of course my bikes have a very easy time of it, after all they only just have to have a little more power than needed to pull a skin off a rice pudding in order to propel me along at the necessary rate of knots. It's in the Griffon too, but from the debris that emanates from the clutch on draining I think it needs changing regularly, whatever one might choose.
                  Hi Adrian,

                  On the subject of oil, I use EP80 (GL4) in the MX4 gearbox.

                  Cheers,
                  Andrew
                  #190
                  Last edited by Brian Thompson; 18/06/2011, 12:31 AM.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Hi All - thanks for all the input..........Think I will stick with Castrol R40 for the 'cooker' - as I think it gives a great smooth shine on the iron bore.......
                    - - - even if it does gum up the exhaust port.......It smells so good !!

                    I'll go with EP 9-0 in the box - and in the chain case - I will try ATF.....unless anybody knows where I can get some shell Vitrea 22 from. (apart from Geoff's van in the pits !!)
                    Thanks again all - cheers Kim

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Emu Oil - A WARNING!!!

                      Originally posted by dave higgins View Post
                      Hi adrian, emu oil? well!! whatever you get up to in your own garage is up to you?, but don`t over do it....
                      As for healthy complection & full head of hair, ( should have gone to spec savers )... dave
                      Hi Dave, hi Adrian!

                      In the absence of an 'official statement' from the GRA Morality Officer (Hi Rob!) in this regard, I feel it is incumbent upon me to warn our newer members of the risks involved in the extremely dangerous activity of extracting Emu oil, as pic 1 should confirm....

                      This process should ONLY be attempted once appropriate training and certification has been achieved by the practitioner. Even then, it should be noted that it has only very recently become possible for this fraught procedure to be attempted by a clubman competitor due to the advances in modern body armour construction. However, the GRA can take no responsibilty whatsoever for any member attempting this procedure and absolves itself from all potential consequences that may be incurred. Adrian is, after all, a trained professional and his skills in this regard are a great credit to his fearless and determined nature as a succesful and tenacious competitor. However, reference to pic 1 will also confirm the benefits of the use of this substance in relation to skin care and hair regeneration...!

                      Further, members should be advised that Emu oil has an extreme reaction when combined with even the slightest trace of ethanol! The resulting fumes are so fowl that being black flagged during a race, incuring a hefty fine from the Clerk of the Course and subsequently being ignominiously 'removed' (with extreme predjudice) from the paddock by fellow competitors being the likely outcome, so BE WARNED!!!

                      As a footnote, it would be remiss of me not to include some 'historical perspective'. In those bleak days before Mr Greeves and Derry Preston-Cobb gave us the finest purpose built off road competition motorcycles ever made, people had to look elswhere for a suitable mount. The Emu was of course the 'weapon of choice' for many competitors in the smaller classes, at least until they were eventually banned by the ACU in 1863 following an unfortunate incident on the startline at the 'infamous' Mabelthorpe Grand National of that year....Decorum prevents me from revisiting the awful events of that terrible day, but to serve as a reminder of happier times pic 2 shows seasoned competitor Doris Ponsby-Forsythe astride her favourite bird Nigel (winner of that years' hotly contested Ostrich class) in the paddock at the Scunthorpe International of 1862.

                      Anyway, must dash lads, the white van has arrived and it's time for my weekly 'care in the community' session....!!!

                      Brian.
                      Attached Files
                      Last edited by Brian Thompson; 04/12/2011, 08:29 AM. Reason: Pics attached.

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                      • #12
                        Hi brian, absolutely brilliant, i have not stopped laughing since, where did all that come from.... respect.
                        Reminds me of my great grandads success in the 1892 emu hurdling championships, it was close, but he won it by a beak!!! .dave.

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                        • #13
                          Rod Hull Appreciation Society!

                          Originally posted by dave higgins View Post
                          Hi brian, absolutely brilliant, i have not stopped laughing since, where did all that come from.... respect.
                          The voices made me do it Dave......!

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                          • #14
                            Hi Kim, such a plethora of information forthcoming all wrapped up in various names and three letter acronyms that I don't blame you for sticking with R for the cooker. If it's any consolation I'm totally confused by it all so will probably stick with what I've been used to as well. Anyway I couldn't possibly use ATF in the clutch aligned to a 4SMGB!
                            P.S. What's TQF?

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