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AMC 2stroke engine ID

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  • AMC 2stroke engine ID

    Somehow I have ended up with a 250cc AMC engine. It is out of a Francis Barnett, and is a very heavy, complex beast. I have been attempting to id the year & model from the engine number, M25S - 17823.
    All the FB sites refer to M25T and M25C, but not M25S - the only engine I've found with that model no is a twin cylinder, and mine is definately a single.
    I know Greeves looked at the amc, then rejected it for their own build instead.
    Can anyone solve this mystery for me, or at least point me in the right direction. Any help would be much appreciated.
    Cheers, Mike

  • #2
    AMC 2 stroke

    Its an AMC 249cc single (66 x 72.8mm) as fitted to the Francis Barnett Cruiser 80 & the James Commodore. These were manufactured by AMC at Woolwich to a design by Piatti. The engine was a disaster mainly due to poor quality control, In 1961 the engines were assembled by Villiers for AMC. The mountings I think are the same as the Villiers 1H single & 2,3 & 4T twins. A lot of FB & James owners fitted Villiers twins after the AMC units failed.
    Greeves never fitted the AMC engine
    Last edited by John Wakefield; 01/12/2012, 10:10 AM. Reason: Commodore added

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    • #3
      Had a 199 AMC motor in a James Trials Special the old man made up. I took my test on it in the late 70's and used it on a daily basis. Also did a few trials. A bit heavy, but had no problems with it. It ran very well. Only one was a broken primary chain.

      Whitehillbillies

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      • #4
        AMC two strokes

        Yes AMC made the 199cc as you mentioned & 149 & 171cc variants as well.
        I think that the idea was to be independent of Villiers, but as history dictates it rather backfired on them. They were never a match for Villiers. Ironically the 199cc & 249cc were very similar to the Villiers 1H 224 cc & 2H 246cc engines which were themselves a bit oddball. Styled more like the twins they were never as succesfull as the 9E & 32A series engines & were not really tuneable.
        James used the 249cc AMC engine in their Cotswold scrambler http://www.simplywizard.co.uk/folders/level3/l25s.htm & Commando Trials http://www.simplywizard.co.uk/folders/level3/l25t.htm
        I dont think they made a 199cc trials so the one you had was probably a converted Captain roadster.
        There is a chapter on the AMC 2 strokes in Roy Bacon's book Villiers Singles & Twins
        Last edited by John Wakefield; 02/12/2012, 10:30 AM. Reason: links to James added

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        • #5
          Correct John, it was a converted roadster.

          whitehillbillies

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          • #6
            Thank you people, I had a good look in my copy of Villiers S&T, and got the details I wanted. The M25S engine I have would have started life in a FB scrambles model 82 circa 1958-62. Also, as they were the same company, in a James Cotswold scrambler of the same era. They were tuned for competition, with a close ratio 4speed gearbox. Going by the engine number, my motor would probably be from around 1961/62.
            Unfortunately, or perhaps fortunately, I have only the motor/gearbox unit, no cycle parts at all, so restoration will not happen. The motor is very heavy, so as a scrambler it could be a lot of hard work, compared to my 9E HJH, which tops out at around 200-210lb, and is very easy to ride.
            Cheers, Mike

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