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  • US Mark 2 MCS

    Calling our US members.........!!

    I have recently been told and now have seen 3 examples of frame numbers in the series 24 MCS/2/xxxx.

    I have been told that because the MCS was so successful in the us, when the MDS was launched, it was marketed in the US as the 'MCS Mark 2'.

    So, in England we have the MDS and in the US, the MCS Mk2.

    The bike has the square section swinging arm, etc and looks for all the world like an MDS apart from the frame number.

    Can anyone tell me if this is true?

    Thanks in anticipation,

    Rob

  • #2
    Rob ,

    Haven't heard of this but any thing is possible , pity the export records didn't survive .

    Perhaps bearingman might have an insight into it .

    Chris

    Comment


    • #3
      Hey all!

      Great topic!

      When I first posted pictures of Ms Eleanor, our 24MCS/2/808...had alot of foks swear I was reading the frame # wrong, had to post some close ups of it.

      Very interesting, and a great loss as for the export records.

      Off topic...but have come accross some ole 4 stroke hondas with a mixed cases...lik 10-15 yrs older than the top end....I did some digging and research to find that it was a factory deal...used up old cases still in stock...so though the frame #'s match with the barrel #'s...anything in the cases require the 15 yr old case serial # for the right part.

      AHHH THE mystery of it all....FUN if ya ask me!

      Good luck all!

      Have a good one
      Tammy
      Attached Files

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Rob View Post
        Calling our US members.........!!

        I have recently been told and now have seen 3 examples of frame numbers in the series 24 MCS/2/xxxx.

        I have been told that because the MCS was so successful in the us, when the MDS was launched, it was marketed in the US as the 'MCS Mark 2'.

        So, in England we have the MDS and in the US, the MCS Mk2.

        The bike has the square section swinging arm, etc and looks for all the world like an MDS apart from the frame number.

        Can anyone tell me if this is true?

        Thanks in anticipation,

        Rob
        Hi Rob and Chris,


        Yes! The USA spec 24MCS/2 is your homeland based MDS. We also received a few MDS models as well, but with a glass tank, muffler and Challenger top end. I'm assuming leftover parts were assembled for Nicholson as these were sold in 64-65 after the Challenger was introduced.

        The difference between our 24MCS/2 and the MDS is minor...same frame, wheels, swing arm, Villiers lower end with Greeves square barrel.

        Most MCS/2 came to the states with 19 inch front wheel and a larger steel tank, though many came with the alloy tank. Folding footrest were specified by Nick as well. Most came with megaphones but some came with a muffler.

        I'm not sure if Nick specified different porting specs or transmission ratios...I would guess the gearing was different for our cross country events, since Moto Cross did not really make it here until the mid sixties.

        There were many 24MCS/2 sold in the USA through Nicholson Motors.

        Happy to help!

        Regards,
        Kenny Sykes
        USA

        Comment


        • #5
          Thanks all! Interesting topic!

          For info, the up to 350 class of the recent Red Marley hill climb was won by Ian Bain riding a MCS/2 complete with banana forks! The engine has been increased to 344cc using a jet ski (or similar) piston.

          Considering the bike is basically standard as far as the frame forks, wheels, etc is concerned, it says a lot for Ian's riding ability! Eat your heart out all those who have spent £15,000+ on 2011 'Pre 65' bikes!

          Incidently, Ian did a similar giant-killing act on the tarmac at last year's Goodwood Revival, seeing off modern replica 'classic' bikes using a pre-war rigid Norton with girder forks!

          I believe these bikes are all home-built by Ian and his Dad too!

          Cheers,

          Rob

          Comment


          • #6
            US mk2 MCS

            Rob,
            Having seen Ian's bikes at close hand I think you'll find that not much is standard.
            Ian is a very talented rider but I think he gets most pleasure from development.
            As far as the cost is concerned, I reckon that if you factor in his development time and costs it would be a lot more than the £2k or so that it costs to buy one.

            Druid

            Comment


            • #7
              Cycle World April 1962 MCS road test

              Hopefully this article I found will help to distinguish the US spec from the UK model.

              Paul
              Attached Files

              Comment


              • #8
                Reviving this thread

                Following on from a thread in General Greeves chat which evolved into a discussion on this model, a search of the site has turned up this thread, started by Rob 6 or 7 years ago, when the existence of this model was barely known this side of the pond.

                Some good information here, but with the passage of time, more may be known about them, in terms of varying specifications etc.

                Clearly some have been re-imported, and it would be good to hear from anyone who owns one. Garybam4711 has two. I bought a basket case a while back, comprising of frame/forks/swinging arm/brake pedal assembly, wheel hubs, some engine parts, but not much else. I had thought of rebuilding it as a trail bike, but am not now sure whether to rebuild it as original.

                Question for Colin - if I go the trail bike route, will there be a problem with dating for registration purposes, given that dispatch records do not exist for export models? I understand they were built from 1962-64.

                Thanks

                Ian

                Comment


                • #9
                  Greeves MCS Mk 2

                  I have a 24MCS Mk2 in my collection. This bike was imported into Australia from the USA about 10 years ago.
                  It has a 19" front wheel, alloy tank, megaphone exhaust and fixed footrests.

                  The frame number is 24MCS/2/1297.

                  Cheers,

                  Ross Martin
                  Attached Files
                  Last edited by rarpos7; 05/01/2018, 05:37 AM.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by IanCordes View Post
                    Following on from a thread in General Greeves chat which evolved into a discussion on this model, a search of the site has turned up this thread, started by Rob 6 or 7 years ago, when the existence of this model was barely known this side of the pond.

                    Some good information here, but with the passage of time, more may be known about them, in terms of varying specifications etc.

                    Clearly some have been re-imported, and it would be good to hear from anyone who owns one. Garybam4711 has two. I bought a basket case a while back, comprising of frame/forks/swinging arm/brake pedal assembly, wheel hubs, some engine parts, but not much else. I had thought of rebuilding it as a trail bike, but am not now sure whether to rebuild it as original.

                    Question for Colin - if I go the trail bike route, will there be a problem with dating for registration purposes, given that dispatch records do not exist for export models? I understand they were built from 1962-64.

                    Thanks

                    Ian
                    Well I've only done a dating certificate for one re-imported bike so far (an Anglian), but that did result in a V5C with an age-related number, so hopefully no problem.

                    All I did was write a letter with a best estimate of the approximate date of manufacture and simply stating the facts as known.

                    Also with a complete reimported bike DVLA requires evidence that import duties have been paid. I don't know what the rules are with basket cases, but you might have some work to do there.

                    Druid, you're welcome to chip in here if you so wish.
                    Colin Sparrow

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by rarpos7 View Post
                      I have a 24MCS Mk2 in my collection. This bike was imported into Australia from the USA about 10 years ago.
                      It has a 19" front wheel, alloy tank, megaphone exhaust and fixed footrests.

                      The frame number is 24MCS/2/1297.

                      Cheers,

                      Ross Martin
                      Ross. Thanks for that. It appears that this model was mostly fitted with a 19" front wheel. I have just been enjoying looking through your gallery btw; a fine collection!

                      Cheers. Ian

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re-imported bikes

                        Colin,
                        I've done a few bikes which have come from the US. In the absence of despatch details I use other markers such as adjacent numbers in the records and model/year of production. This usually does the trick. The good thing about imports is that they are unlikely to have been forged/amended whatever, so they are honest bikes.

                        As far as import taxes due, I leave that to the owner to sort out, not our remit, I do offer help where appropriate but no more than that.

                        Druid

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Colin; Druid. As there are no export records, are there any adjacent numbers in the records for the MCS mk2? If so, one assumes that not all were exported. I did not import it, I bought it as a project from a chap in Kent several years ago (for £250; those were the days!). Therefore not only do I have no import paperwork, I have no evidence to show it was ever exported, apart from it being an export model, which in itself is no proof that it ever went abroad; just an assumption.

                          If there are no MCS mk2 numbers in the dispatch records, that may make things more difficult, despite the fact that we know they followed on from the MCS, and were concurrent with the UK spec MDS from 1962-64.

                          Ian

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Thanks Druid, exactly my approach. Must be doing something right for once.

                            Ian, there are no 24MCS Mk 2s on the UK dispatch record, so it must have been exported.

                            Don't worry about it at this stage, we'll sort it out when the bike is complete.

                            In any case, I'm not going to take part in protracted discussions on dating and authentication on here, and especially not regarding any particular machine.

                            Putting it simply: you asked a question, I answered it.
                            Colin Sparrow

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              It was a general comment on a particular model Colin, given its unique status as a model which had a different designation when exported, which seemed perfectly valid to me; unless I am missing something?

                              Sorry if I have touched a raw nerve, as did your last comment with me.

                              Stifling comments on here will discourage contributors, if they feel they are going to be snapped at. Don't worry about replying, I don't wish to waste your time.

                              I will contribute nothing further on this topic.

                              Ian

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